HTC 10 Camera Thread

[lost_]

The reviews are a mixed bag so far. Here are some that are helpful. The comparison photos would give you some ideas of the capability.

DxOMark Rating 88 (same as S7 scores; but look at the individual scores). Full review now available - thanks @fernando sor)
HTC 10 photos by PRO photographers on grryo, part of power of 10 campaign
Tech Insider HTC 10 vs S7 Camera uh-oh, some issues with the 10
Android Headline Low Light Shootout: Galaxy S7 vs HTC 10 vs LG G5 vs Nexus 6p (thanks @ZooMas)
(direct link to photos from Android Headlines: flickr album with exif)
Engadget Taiwan HTC 10 vs S7 samples (thanks @One Twelve, post), HTC 10 Samples
Ars technica comparison photos from HTC 10, S7, Nexus 5X and iPhone 6S
SlashGear HTC 10 Camera Review and Samples
Techno Buffalo full resolution JPG samples
Android Central Initial HTC 10 Photo & Video Samples from this article
Android Authority First Impression album from this article
Engadget 25 sample photos


I would take these reviews with a grain of salt. For example, the ars technica impression of the photos is a bit misleading IMO. The best photo of a dark scene isn't necessarily the brightest and most colorful (the most faithful capture, not adding light or color that wasn't there, yet retaining details in the shadow, is the best for me -- in addition to noise control).

I asked HTC about the camera issues mentioned on the tech insider review such as this glare and this sharpness issues. The exposure control issues can be addressed with software later, but the glare issue may indicate that the physical lens is more glare prone (compared to the S7 in that photo). This Android Central's photo of an easy outdoor scene shows a lack of sharpness and micro contrast, which may be a combined result of the glare-prone lens and the sharpness issue identified by the tech insider review. That glare issue, however, is NOT a problem on this photo from SlashGear.

Anyway, those are a very small sampling of photos. Post your HTC 10 pics here when you have them so we can all see them!

 

[Deleted member 3005899]

Low light comparison between S7, 10, G5 and 6P I want to see some raw file comparisons between all of these

 

[Jooosty]

Definitely still issues with over exposure. Blowing up backgrounds with light. Had this issue since the M8

Sent from my SM-G935T using XDA-Developers mobile app

 

[Deleted member 739586]

The camera looks gorgeous compared to my M9....

 

[vegetaleb]

If only the ''testers'' people who have the 10 can posts photos here it would be nice :good:

 

[hamdir]

Definitely still issues with over exposure. Blowing up backgrounds with light. Had this issue since the M8

Sent from my SM-G935T using XDA-Developers mobile app

on the M8 it was using touch focus instead of auto focus

on the 10 its auto HDR messing up sometimes its on by default but cant be turned off



---------- Post added at 10:44 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:40 AM ----------

we were begging HTC to reduce sharpness and processing for years so now when they finally did it we bash them?

if i am not mistake sharpness and contrast can be controlled in settings > cam options

i would take the image on top any day, it's more natural and real

but it clearly needs a slight +0.5 sharpness +0.5 contrast

 

[fernando sor]

The reviews are a mixed bag so far. Here are some that are helpful. The comparison photos would give you some ideas of the capability.

DxOMark Rating 88 (same as S7; but look at the individual scores. No photos from the 10 shown yet)
HTC 10 photos by PRO photographers on grryo, part of power of 10 campaign
Tech Insider HTC 10 vs S7 Camera uh-oh, some issues with the 10
Android Headline Low Light Shootout: Galaxy S7 vs HTC 10 vs LG G5 vs Nexus 6p (thanks Zoomas)
(direct link to photos from Android Headlines: flickr album with exif)
Ars technica comparison photos from HTC 10, S7, Nexus 5X and iPhone 6S
SlashGear HTC 10 Camera Review and Samples
Techno Buffalo full resolution JPG samples
Android Central Initial HTC 10 Photo & Video Samples from this article
Engadget 25 sample photos


I would take these reviews with a grain of salt. For example, the ars technica impression of the photos is a bit misleading IMO. The best photo of a dark scene isn't necessarily the brightest and most colorful (the most faithful capture, not adding light or color that wasn't there, yet retaining details in the shadow, is the best for me -- in addition to noise control).

I asked HTC about the camera issues mentioned on the tech insider review such as this glare and this sharpness issues. The exposure control issues can be addressed with software later, but the glare issue may indicate that the physical lens is more glare prone (compared to the S7 in that photo). This Android Central's photo of an easy outdoor scene shows a lack of sharpness and micro contrast, which may be a combined result of the glare-prone lens and the sharpness issue identified by the tech insider review. That glare issue, however, is NOT a problem on this photo from SlashGear.

Anyway, those are a very small sampling of photos. Post your HTC 10 pics here when you have them so we can all see them!

dxomark has the full review up

 

[lost_]

we were begging HTC to reduce sharpness and processing for years so now when they finally did it we bash them?

I don't see anyone on this thread bashing them (the "we" in your question). Reviewers can say what they want, many warranted, many are off-target. But it's a discussion forum, so it's fine to have a discussion about image qualities without being accused of complaining or whining or bashing. The NYC wall lacks sharpness - it is what it is. It could be that reviewer got a bad unit, or it could be other things.

 

[lost_]

dxomark has the full review up

Thanks. Those pics help put the scores in perspective. For example, the cons include "Visible loss of sharpness in the corners compared to the center" BUT they compared the center sharpness of an object that is far out vs the corner sharpness of an object that is near the photographer - NOT on the same plane and, based on the scene distance, most likely not even within the circle of confusion. Why they did that really baffles me!

 

[Deleted member 3005899]

Thanks. Those pics help put the scores in perspective. For example, the cons include "Visible loss of sharpness in the corners compared to the center" BUT they compared the center sharpness of an object that is far out vs the corner sharpness of an object that is near the photographer - NOT on the same plane and, based on the scene distance, most likely not even within the circle of confusion. Why they did that really baffles me!

I feel it's warranted to do that, the hyperfocal distance on phone cameras is usually tiny, everything past couple of meters ends up being in infinity zone anyway.

 

[hamdir]

Things to keep in mind auto HDR is on by default which could cause all sorts of issues if you are unaware it's happening (like blurs)

 

[lost_]

I feel it's warranted to do that, the hyperfocal distance on phone cameras is usually tiny, everything past couple of meters ends up being in infinity zone anyway.

I know what you mean, except that corner tree that they chose looks much closer to the photographer. Again, if they 're going to do that kind of analysis, then they'd better choose a more suitable scene or do it in a controlled manner. I just don't think that scene is valid choice for a lens center to corner sharpness comparison. Anyway, DxOMark is just one source of sample images and I can now interpret their scoring better for my purpose.

 

[Deleted member 3005899]

I know what you mean, except that corner tree that they chose looks much closer to the photographer. Again, if they 're going to do that kind of analysis, then they'd better choose a more suitable scene or do it in a controlled manner. I just don't think that scene is valid choice for a lens center to corner sharpness comparison. Anyway, DxOMark is just one source of sample images and I can now interpret their scoring better for my purpose.

I concur, honestly now that most phones can do RAW, they shouldbe comparing that instead of the proccesed jpg, they don't compare the jpg's for their camera tests

 

[jamiee6610]

I asked HTC about the camera issues mentioned on the tech insider review such as this glare and this sharpness issues. The exposure control issues can be addressed with software later, but the glare issue may indicate that the physical lens is more glare prone (compared to the S7 in that photo). This Android Central's photo of an easy outdoor scene shows a lack of sharpness and micro contrast, which may be a combined result of the glare-prone lens and the sharpness issue identified by the tech insider review. That glare issue, however, is NOT a problem on this photo from SlashGear.

Anyway, those are a very small sampling of photos. Post your HTC 10 pics here when you have them so we can all see them!

I wouldnt take it too seriously about the glare, 2 things when doing stuff like this you have to do a like for like in comparison. Getting too close so the fruit was at a different focal range yes it will have different lighting and not focus the same and the sun behind the tree in one shot and passed in the other? Like WTF? Or course the lighting would show a glare funny thing is go on the S7/edge and its been mentioned numerous times they are suffering too with the same damn problem!

The comparison wasnt credible in my opinion?

HTC dropped the ball with the camera setup they should have put this lense on a duo lense setup like the M8 it would be a beast! I loved my M8 contributed quite a lot on the forums here with photos from it but my biggest gripe was why 4MP? It was commonly accepted that what the M8 needed to be on top was a larger lense to actually harvest more details in the light being captured.
Frustrating as hell! I just wish they had brought back that Duo lense we would see something that would have sunk the competition hard and fast in performance.

 

[vegetaleb]

I am using the 10 camera app on my A9 thanks to Leedroid, in Auto you can disable HDR, control exposure but not sharpness unless there is a hidden menu

Sent from my HTC One A9 using XDA Free mobile app

 

[domineus]

I am using the 10 camera app on my A9 thanks to Leedroid, in Auto you can disable HDR, control exposure but not sharpness unless there is a hidden menu

Sent from my HTC One A9 using XDA Free mobile app

I don't think there's a sharpness menu option. The A9 began the trend of removing the sharpness with the results being images being a bit too flat (nothing wrong with that especially compared to the oversharp gs7/gs6)

However, I think HTC struck a decent balance with the 10. The issues of camera is something I've even seen on my rx1rii so it's not something that can be easily solved

 

[vprasad1]

Any low light comparisons with the Huawei P9?

Sent from my SM-G386T using Tapatalk

 

[One Twelve]

Things to keep in mind auto HDR is on by default which could cause all sorts of issues if you are unaware it's happening (like blurs)

Yeah, this could explain the eye brow raising shots i found on the verge. Now if there was a simple way to identify when hdr is on or not in the exifs, it will become easier. Will spare from the 'not impressed' posts.

Not how a camera, according to dxo, that is as sharp as the nexus and has as good artifacts handling as the 808 should behave.

In the meantime i went digging for better samples and engadget taiwan has done a much better job than engadget headoffice.

https://flic.kr/s/aHsky4WQQP

and a comparison with the S7

https://flic.kr/s/aHsky8MB4Q

Exifs, full rez the lot.

---------- Post added at 11:13 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:52 PM ----------

on the M8 it was using touch focus instead of auto focus

on the 10 its auto HDR messing up sometimes its on by default but cant be turned off

HDR can be turned off. See 2:30 here

we were begging HTC to reduce sharpness and processing for years so now when they finally did it we bash them?

here is something more subtle. First is s7, second is the 10

s7e2 by bittie kwan, on Flickr

m10b by bittie kwan, on Flickr

htc10vs7e by bittie kwan, on Flickr

It surprises me how high the ISO's have to be on the 10 for the bottle top. The F stop difference is 1/6.Shutter speed difference is negligible. But ISO wise its almost 2.5stops (!)

Clearly these companies are doing iso curves quite differently.The 10 isn't using any image averaging like HDR+.

 

[duowing]

I would really like to see some people pull some comparison photos from the S7 in auto, then take to raw/pro mode with the HTC 10 and set it up to match the auto settings that the S7 is doing and see if the pictures then are comparable. It would be the best way to see sensor vs. processing, I would think? Also I know very little about imaging, so I also could be completely wrong. Also I would like to just see shots set up in conditions to the same ISO, shutter speed, etc and see then what kind of differences we're looking at.

 

[lost_]

It surprises me how high the ISO's have to be on the 10 for the bottle top. The F stop difference is 1/6.Shutter speed difference is negligible. But ISO wise its almost 2.5stops (!)

Clearly these companies are doing iso curves quite differently.The 10 isn't using any image averaging like HDR+.

Thanks for the links - they've been added to the first post.

The curtain scene is another telltale about the metering algorithm and exposure. All else equal, the S7 was ISO 200 and the 10 was ISO 500, 1.3 more stop, which ends up lighting up the dark side of the curtain but also clipping the highlights sooner without revealing additional details in the shadow. The same goes with the horse statue scene (ISO 200 vs ISO 320). It seems in dark scenes with strong highlights, the 10 exposure shifts toward higher ISO to light up the shadows, while the S7 is happy in keeping the shadows dark; some of us grow up doing minus exposure compensation in that kind of scene to keep the shadow black instead of gray, and that seems to be what S7 is doing while the 10 wants to make it gray.

The outdoor samples from the 10 are pretty good IMO. They're not overexposed and soft like the NYC samples.